Everybody has a plan until they get hit.

But Singlecell why come after me if they don't know I have anything more than anyone else?

Zana, though the average TEOTWAWKI website tend to probably over highlight the points you made in your original post, I think that security is indeed a concern and you would be targeted at some point. That is unless you are 100s of km to nowhere. Thinking like the "enemy" if I was a smart but desperate urbanite, I would think of leaving the area in favour of the country side - where you live. The fact that you would remain well fed, have smoke coming from the chimney, display a lush garden, etc, will all serve as a beacon to those who want what you have. Using your line about the parent that just wants to feed his children, you have to think of what next. You give them a bit of food, enough for a week maybe and then what? He comes back for more? Tells his friends where he found food? Then a group turn up at your house... That is why the security issue is often stressed. I personally don't thin security is in having machine gun posts around my property, but rather to have a close knit group that can help (seems like you do) but also capable to respond rapidly enough to help out : so means of communication and distance is a problem to consider.

From long way back then throughout history, people need no real reason to take what other's have. Therefore trying to do some reasoning with some uninvited horde of looters will likely fail. I've seen people that look feeble and nice, in an unfavored situation can switch sides easily. Hesitation and overly compassion can cost you your life. Young does not mean they are harmless, old does not mean they are wise. We should be nice with people, but we must read their intentions.

Living far off the main road indeed increase your probability to stay undisturbed for a considerable period of time during TEOTWAWKI. However when thing's start going bad in big cities, naturally many will scour rural area in search of safety and food even that means they have to force the rural dwellers. I myself will avoid to hurt people. But if someone threatening my life, I will do anything I can to stay alive. Neighbors is a great asset. They're like an outpost for our castle, and we are like an outpost to their castle. Self sufficiency is step one, the next is to extend your line of defense and plan a safety net for hours of need.

Helicopilot already describe about scouting party, really have to put that in your considerations. Who knows, they may leave you unharmed, but they expose your location and leave markings. During a disaster once when I was young ~ I do a kind of looting in abandoned house, but there are some groups that just want to loot from survivors just for fun, just because they can and no one will going to stop them anyway at that moment.

Haha Just a quote I have found quite useful to reference of late. You bring up an interesting point though. "Everyone will bother the mormons before me" Why is this?

I've been reading too many US prepper sites-I think. So many are talking about fighting off the armed hordes coming after your supplies and how you need to form a tactical team of like-minded people to survive.

This is a result of the psyche of the culture. In the US it's a very independent "can do, I'm on my own and nobody's looking out for me and my own but me" type of culture.

Not to mention that many of them believe that officials from their government are keeping a list of preppers so in times of need they can commandeer their supplies.

Not as much a belief as documented fact. Several democrat states have actually asked shop keepers in many types of stores to keep tabs on who's buying what could be construed as "prepper supplies and gear" in notable quantities.

Personally I will be in my home ( in the country) and my daughters will have BOBs with everything they'll need for the day or two walk home. I am considering and learning what I need to do to secure my home. Some I will set up now. Other things like razor wire I will have on hand in case. My main aim is self sufficientcy -digging a root cellar,growing a garden,an apple tree ,ensuring a good water supply when my pump won't work, growing some natural medicine and making a wood stove fed hot tub. I also want to practice some alternate methods of building. As long as my projects are 120 sq feet or less I don't need a building permit.
In the case of some long term emergency most of my neighbours will be fine. They have canned all their lives and hunted too. I'll have to trade supplies or hunt, but will probably grow tabaco or something to trade. But there are more than enough deer,moose,rabbits etc to go around. As long as I keep my mouth shut about my supplies, everyone will bother the Mormons in my area before me. I plan to work with my neighbors to help any of us having problems and help organize trading so we are all ok. That said I am buying some guns and holsters and will probably stay armed a lot. But, shooting someone who needs to feed their children isn't something I want to do. Am I nieve to think it could be that way?

Remember that as supplies go to pot, everybody will be thinking the same thing and picking up a rifle to go kill themselves some wildlife. After a period, there will be none left and hijacking other people's kills will begin to occur more often, with it leading up to ambush and murder as times worsen... So yeah, being able to protect yourself against humans might be something to not poo-poo.

I believe that organizing a community and being able to carry out basic functions as well as a much needed specialty will lend to a much higher survival rate. Solo actors will be the first to fall to any bands of raiders, should they emerge as a problem.

-S.

Haha Just a quote I have found quite useful to reference of late. You bring up an interesting point though. "Everyone will bother the mormons before me" Why is this?

Mormons are required to put aside provisions in the Book of Mormon.

-S.

huh...shooting neigbours...your neigbours? really? this is your A game? I suggest you start planning for a different outcome..thats a fail everyway you cut it.

"Everybody has a plan until they get hit."

Those 8 words have a lot of truth, there are no good plans, they all go out the window when it hits the fan. Those telling you different are likely selling something. Here is the only plan I know works...plan to develop skills, lots of them, you only get skills by doing things, so be a verb, not a noun, don't ever be mistaken for a stationary object. Try everything, fail and learn...

Zana, looks like I read too fast, I missed what you said at the end

"shooting someone who needs to feed their children isn't something I want to do. Am I nieve to think it could be that way?"

No your not nieve...The ones thinking they are a army of one, slaying at will are... always identify these types right off the bat..it will make your life easier.

I wonder how many of the people on here are Mormons or lds I am and while I plan to feed my family I also have no problem shooting someone who will be trying to take our stuff because you have to think that in any situation all woman will be a target because history has always proven it so while you don't have to arm yourself or even shoot someone when 5-10 men are walking towards you with the intent of gang rapping you because that always happens in any disaster situation. While each person has there own opinion on how you should prepare I always tell people to prepare for what they are willing to fight for and to never forget that any disaster the rules are out the window for life and people will do stuff just because they can but it doesn't hurt to try to network and create a group or even work with your neighbours and create a block party group that way in a situation everyone will work together. A great book to buy is "there is no fema" its online it has a lot of information I own it and share it with others near me.

Everything you all say is good. Learning many skills including shooting is the best thing to do. I plan to arm myself and if someone is out to hurt me or steal from me the coyotes will be fed. But, as far as people needing food I think one of the ways to not be overwhelmed would be to always trade even if it's for their labor. I think as a community we would be best to agree on a strategy for newcomers. I defiantly would not allow anyone to squat on my land. Too many legal hassles possible.
Although I will be alone to start with my girls plan to join me if it's best for them. They will no doubt bring their guys with them. My eldest has requested the tree house be heightened to provide her with a sniper tower.

Zana I think you are keeping the right attitude and adjusting as you come upon new information or advice that makes sense to you.
This is all any of us can do in reality. You are fortunate to have a place of your own to go about preparing on your terms. There are many of us out there still working in other circumstances, but that is life.
If you want a sniper tower, make sure it doesn't look like one. High ground is great, but towers tend to be hard to get out of safely when someone else has a wink on you.
If you haven't had the chance to have a prepper with tactical knowledge evaluate your place yet then there are plenty on this site who would come help you without begging to join you and therefore make you uncomfortable.
I think at this point getting to know the opinions your neighbours have on all this is a good thing. If they are on board with strengthening the little community there and working with each other if things get bad enough, then the next step is giving them all two way radios for Christmas and start sharing goodies with them now. It'll go a long way.
There are many good and decent preppers who are stuck in rentals and don't have a place to go. They are seeking someone like you and you could do well by getting to know some of them away from your place.
For those of us with small groups and a place to go it's a good start, but there are always challenges and life does go on.
I wish you well.

Like Mr. Myagi always counselled, avoiding confrontation is best. But when push comes to shove, better to go balls to the wall and be the victor.

If you have an out of the way location and can "go stealth," you can delay contact, but probably not perpetually.

But while "A plan only survives until first contact with the enemy," it would still be wise to try and plan out foreseeable situations to have a starting point. If you can plan this and make moral decisions you are comfortable with in a non-stressed situation, it'll make your life easier when in a crisis situation.

A very simple example ... if you are probed by a group / or asked for assistance ... do you give them a) nothing (doesn't show your hand but could breed resentment and a return by night), b) a little bit (e.g. just water) (possibly the "middle of the road option"), c) a substantial amount of support and food (unlikely to cause hard feelings but paints a bullseye on you and your family / group?

A slightly more complicated situation. Somebody, or a small group, finds your patch of semi-isolated land. It could even be before SHTF (maybe you only visit the land occasionally, and use it for recreational use) or after. Let's say they are trespassing, maybe trying to poach. You politely request that they leave. Things get nasty. They make a bunch of threats to you and your family and then begrudgingly slowly leave. What are your choices? a) put your head in the sand and hope that everything is okay, and try to forget it all happened, b) beef up your security measures as much as possible, knowing that it could be futile because an attacker only needs to be lucky once and a defender has to be lucky ALL the time, c) panic, try to sell your land for a loss in a recession and relocate somewhere else to try and start your OPSEC afresh), or d) quickly pull out your 4G compatible iPad and Google "how to dig a shallow grave" and pre-empt the problem. I suppose e) might be to invoke the trespass act, detain the ne'er do wells and hand them over to the police. Best case scenario is that they already have a criminal record or outstanding warrant and end up in jail for a few weeks or a few months. What do you think is going to be one of the first things they are going to do (other than get high on illicit drugs and catch some STIs) once they get out? That's right - give you and your family a visit while you are sitting around your campfire one weekend evening singing "Kumbaya."

I certainly don't have all the answers. But I do have lots of questions... not sure that helps anybody though! 😀

I am a believer in working towards the self sufficiency aspect as well. I do not revel in the concept that mankind would decline overnight due to some catastrophe, but don't doubt that some folks will indeed turn violent at the drop of a hat. I too would attempt to try and build a secure neighborhood that could band together in times of need.

I also know fair well that the majority of them won't be prepared until SHTF either. So therefore the best that you can do is prepare and have a plan ready which you can inevitably present to neighbors if that moment should arise. Having items such as razor wire on hand but not installed is also a good measure. (One has to realize that sort of thing can cause injury before it's required to and neighbors would classify you as nuts now which would affect later attempts at uniting for a common cause later). Seems you already have the right idea for much of your preparation. One should store enough food until they can grow a garden to provide a sustainable living. Growing extra provides you with a buffer to allow for sharing and trading.

Too many go on the pretense that society will escalate into total anarchy overnight. Criminal activity will be rampant and all crimes will go unpunished. I believe many folks will band together to prevent such from happening. We may indeed have folks hanging from a tree to remind others of such a fate... who knows. But we can't let our belief in mankind to be so diminished that we become exactly that which we fear..... You can still be cautious without having to digress to the mindset that no one is trustworthy but you.