I've been learning instinctive archery for the last year or so. I wanted a no fuss simple bow and a recurve suited what I need. On a good day I can hit the target consistently from 20-40 yards. However....today I tried taking out one of the squirrels that torments my garbage and was digging up corn seeds today....I ended up losing 5 carbon arrows, and killing 0 squirrels. LOL So... the point of my story is you need to practice, practice, practice for a bow to be of any use when you really need it. Back to practicing for me! I will get this squirrel one day!

😉

I have spent 25 years in archery and just getting back into guns in the last couple years. My fingers go asleep now after just a few shots and changing over to releases wasn't in the cards for me as teaching this old dog a new trick is sometimes hard. We have a crossbow and I don't quite take to it either as it is heavy and awkward. The option of using such weapons for prepping is therefore one I think I can add my honest opinion on with confidence.

I spent alot on archery as a hobby and for hunting. Not only does a decent bow cost the price of a rifle, arrows are now running about $10-15 each when you include the broadhead to the total cost per arrow. Therefore when you lose an arrow such as TinfoilHats mentions, it adds up quickly. This same pricing occurs with crossbow bolts and you can lose them even easier as they are shorter and shot at almost twice the poundage.

I used to make my own arrows from bulk purchase. I often bought throwaway wood shafts to use as Flu-Flu bird arrows for those on the fly, and even spent a winter hunting with bow to see how well I could do.... I only lost alot of arrows due to the bows limbs grow deader with each degree of temperature drop. Since the natives must have hunted in the winter, so would I. 😳 I got to the point that I only shot with a tree as a backstop so I could at least dig the arrow out.

It is with all this experience and knowing the investment it cost for fletching jigs, shafts, broadheads, vanes, arrow straighteners, bow press, etc., that I suggest it not be very high on your prepper list. In retrospect, a high powered pellet gun is likely the best silent weapon you could invest in.

You have to shoot at least 6 arrows a day to stay in good shooting form. While shooting, you practice the draw(while working those muscles daily so you can do it easily at high poundage), you learn the cock(angle) of your wrist, your grip (or open hand shoot as I do), your anchor(the anchor point your draw to consistently) , the cock of your elbow, the projected trajectory path of the arrow (mental judgement practice) and lastly, your release. If you do any of these differently than your usual form, the arrow does not make it's predicted mark! So unless you have alot of time to dedicate to archery, I'd suggest to save your money for other stuff of higher priority first.

BTW, I owned both recurve and compound bows at the same time and found to be truly skilled with one, I had to completely give up shooting the other. The recurve was a bare bow and I shot instinctively(no sights). One's judgement gets altered when shooting another bow and interferes with the natural instincts somehow. Second, your draw is shorter on recurve due to the further you draw, the harder it gets, which is untrue with compounds. Third, your anchor point, elbow position, everything including your stance is therefore different. Thus, it is better to be a master of one than to be lesser at both!

That said...it sure is a satisfying hobby when you hit targets instinctive shooting...much more so than firearms related sports I find.

All good points knuckles and Tinfoilhats and very valid too.

To me it works out with little practice but we are all different and I only need to hit the lung part of the deer. My broad head will do the actually killing by slicing through the lungs and effectively drowning the deer for me. But I also enjoy bow hunting so that works out well as Hunting deer is really what its all about for me now and in a shtf situation. What I enjoy doing today just have a practical use in a shtf situation.

My only comment and advice here regarding the cost. Go have a look at Ebay if you are interested in adding archery to your preps. Get an older bow as they are super cheap as in less than $ 100. Honestly if you could take deer with them 20 years ago you can do so now and in another 20 years. You do not necessarily have to go out and buy a brand new cool Compound bow (although they are awesome !) a used bow can do the same thing. Just make sure the string is good and you have it properly maintained. You can find arrows and broad heads there cheap too although knuckles are right it can get pricey so look for deals or used. But know what you want the archery for. If you have no plans to hunt in a shtf situation or only want to hunt with a rifle then archery would be a waste of money. However if you are going to hunt deer, you want to do it silently and with a bow. Well then maybe my advice and my way of doing it can help you or inspire you to find your way of prepping archery.

You still need to learn how to shoot the bow and do some level of practice. I guess it individual opinions on how much you need. But you cannot do this successfully without some practice.

Knuckles you mentioned a high powered pellet gun and I had a friend that I used to hunt grouse and rabbits with after normal hunt. I would bring a small 20 gauge shotgun and he would bring his high powered pellet gun. I must admit to being very sceptical at first... However he did prove me wrong and did actually manage to harvest both grouse and rabbits with it. Now it did have a distinct loud crack when fired. But I doubt that that sound be heard from 1 kilometer away. Now I don't know if it could I just think it was loud to us but I don't think it was loud enough to be heard far away.

Have you got any experiences with these high powered pellet guns knuckles ?. Am I right in saying that rabbits is probably the biggest kill you can make with a high powered pellet gun ?. After seeing my friends out hunting effectively I am seriously considering adding one to the inventory just for grouse and rabbits.

I was looking into a good pellet rifle a while back and these Weirauch's seemed to be the bee's knee's for all the guys in the UK into "ratting"

http://www.dlairgun.com/Air-Rifles/Weihrauch/021_HW_97_KL.html

There are alot of dangers in buying a used bow on EBay. If a compound bow is ever dry fired(released from full draw with no arrow), the limbs often crack, especially in the crotch where the pulley is located. These are hard to spot and you must look close as the bow can easily injure the shooter when it breaks. This is often the reason people sell their bow as they are afraid of it after a dry fire. One cannot check it over on EBay previous to purchasing, so I'd either request good close up photos from various perspectives or not take the risk.

As for pellet guns, I mentioned in another thread here that I carried a pellet gun often when guiding to shoot small game as my tourists already had high powered rifles. In this way I didn't scare away a moose while getting lunch. Seems the old pellet guns had more power as many of these new ones can kill crap unless you buy high powered ones with your PAL license. I don't have a decent one these days but do intend on purchasing either a 1200 fps .177 cal or a 800 fps .22 cal to remedy that soon. I can't say I'd look at TinfoilHat's weapon of choice as it is rather pricey. I will opt for the Umarex Surge XT Air Rifle(.177 cal) for $150 or the Benjamin Titan™ NP Break-Barrel Air Rifle (.22 cal) for $160. My son left one of those pump-up pellet guns from Crappy Tire for $130 and it seems to only annoy the local squirrels when I shoot them, but little else!

I admit that I do miss archery but gave it up the same way I gave up riding hardtails after 21 years(motorcycles with no shocks on the frame). Seems old age isn't all our elders said it would be 👿 Arthritis and sore backs are becoming part of the daily routine I often spray some WD40 on my hands to even pull a few wrenches some days as it fixes the pain better than any pill ever can 😆 (another tidbit of knowledge there boy!)

There are alot of dangers in buying a used bow on EBay. If a compound bow is ever dry fired(released from full draw with no arrow), the limbs often crack, especially in the crotch where the pulley is located. These are hard to spot and you must look close as the bow can easily injure the shooter when it breaks. This is often the reason people sell their bow as they are afraid of it after a dry fire. One cannot check it over on EBay previous to purchasing, so I'd either request good close up photos from various perspectives or not take the risk.
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Very true. You have to be careful with purchasing on Ebay. When I did shop on Ebay I used Paypal for payments and if I had found a crack in any of the compound bows I purchased and it was not mentioned in the description I would make a claim through Paypal and Ebay. That is their policy to ensure that you do not get ripped off. But of course even with that you have the hassle and time invested in doing so.

I have been lucky I have not had any issues with the 4 compound bows I purchased through Ebay. They were all reasonably described and although one came with rusty screws etc I had little work to get them ready. But that does not mean that you will be lucky every time :). Do your homework. Check the pictures like knuckles suggest here. Read the description and even submit a question or several to ensure that the bow is okay. That way you cover yourself and get your money back with no issues should you receive a faulty bow or a bow with damages not mentioned. Never buy a bow described "as if". That suggest to me the owner knows about issues but don't want to describe them. Inspect the bow upon delivery and check against the description and communication you may have had with the seller. Any variance you should make a claim through Ebay. The seller does not get his money until after 30 days of payment so you have some time to receive the bow and make inspection. Once you have made a claim the seller will not get paid until its been arbitrary dealt with.

Now off to the archery range :). I feel inspired...

I guess that you could score some good deals thru EBay then but I have lost a few times (out of 50+ purchases) without trying something I consider as risky. I buy mostly new items on EBay as it is still cheaper than buying here where I live.

Some hints: (in case you haven't already discovered them yourself)

- buy green florescent nocks as they are the first thing I often spot when arrow hunting. Why they show up better, I don not know but I convert as many arrows as I can due to this little detail.
- I also run a second layer of fletching glue around every vane (I know it creates more drag) as it keeps the arrows complete alot longer this way.
- Tie a 3" piece of light thread under each arrow tip to show me windage as I draw without having to use talcom powder or whatever others seem to use.
- Don't use those quivers that attach to the bow as each arrow used affects the balance of the bow.
- practice resting the arrow between the middle and index finger of your bow hand while you draw, and then set it on the rest after. This eliminates the sound of the shaft dragging on the rest as you draw.
- shoot with open bow hand and have bow rest on palm, with bow's pressure as straight to arm as possible. This eliminates a cocked wrist affecting the release.(while using wrist strap so you don't drop the bow)
- shooting blind helps you concentrate on what your hands are doing as you release. Practice shooting 10 ft away from butt with eyes closed. You can't possibly miss and you can now focus totally on grip, wrist cock, elbow, breathing, and release.
- try shooting with a finger tab only, to feel the whole process better, especially with recurve or longbow for instinctual shooting.
- don't practice with stabilizers and such if you are not going to hunt with them too....
- practice with cheap arrows so you can shoot them properly when hunting
- quit shooting at ranges where you know the distance to target. Shoot at uknown distances to hone your instinctual judgement as any other skill

I've been learning instinctive archery for the last year or so. I wanted a no fuss simple bow and a recurve suited what I need. On a good day I can hit the target consistently from 20-40 yards. However....today I tried taking out one of the squirrels that torments my garbage and was digging up corn seeds today....I ended up losing 5 carbon arrows, and killing 0 squirrels. LOL So... the point of my story is you need to practice, practice, practice for a bow to be of any use when you really need it. Back to practicing for me! I will get this squirrel one day!

😉

hi Tinfoilhats ? where do you train ? I believe Academy of Duello has such program. That's the only one I know in GVA.

Knuckle ! your post is amazing thank you.

If you aren't going to practice regularly a bow just gives you a false sense of security. In your SHTF situation you need everything to work, and work well when you are probably less than your best.
Get a good crossbow, and by good I mean nothing less than an Excalibur.
Compound crossbows don't last, you need a recurve. The only thing you need is spare strings and you can replace those yourself without special equipment.
Crossbows are very accurate to beyond 40 yards - every shot. You don't dare shoot at the same point twice when practicing because the odds are you'll damage your previous arrow or the fletching. This is exactly what you want when every shot has to count.

The only bow now that is still in my house is a Barnett Revolution crossbow the wife owns. Our neighbor killed a nuisance bear in our yard a few years back with his crossbow as we didn't want MNR after us and then going thru the house for weapons. As we get alot of bears here, the wife wanted a bow she could shoot if she so wished. The thing is heavy at 8.5 lbs without the quiver mounted.

The flaw with any composite limb is that any drop in temperature has a great effect in the accuracy of the weapon therefore not taking a practice shot before hand in such conditions will often lead to a wounding instead of a clean kill. Having an arrow found later with your numbers on it (or other identifying features) stuck in an animal might be frowned upon.

Now what I see many don't consider is with either the bow or crossbow, you have an expense factor that is high. The weapons main value is their quietness. Yet the lack of shock from impact allows the game to travel before they die as they run on adrenalin by reflex alone. To become a bow hunter or crossbow hunter therefore requires you to learn many other aspects such as tracking and all leads back to perfecting the arrow placement when you initially shoot. Shoot high and the animal has just internal bleeding and no blood trail...good luck with finding your prey as tracking again isn't as simple as television portrays. So you must get good at shooting if you expect the rewards from trying to kill with it! If your not willing to go all the way to be good, why start? I blew $2000 in archery and gear back when it would be like $3000 at least by now!

Now the pellet rifle is my new best friend. I shoot it daily as my shooting range is just out my back door. I now have a Gamo Shadow Walker that I showed before all camoed up. It cost me $100 used and I now have $200 total into it as the original scope was junk. I replaced it with a Bushnell air rifle 3-9 x 50 and make consistent hits and kills at 25 yards on partridge and other small critters. I don't proclaim all kinds of great distance as pellets have too much inconsistency in exact sizing to be reliable beyond that.

Here is my shooting range. The metal targets are at 17 yards and the paper is at 25 Yards. The metal target is really for 22's but the bottom ones still swing when hit by a 1200 fps .177 pellet. This is my lazy man's way of knowing it was a kill shot. The paper is for sighting in mostly as I have to walk there and back when in doubt as my 20 x 60 spotting scope often doesn't show all. If you look over to the left closely you can even see the steel frame of my hanging archery bag stand. No, we don't shoot the rottweiler! 🙄

LOL Knuckle I am not sure what to make of your post :).

You always tell a good story and I do enjoy that. But what was the point here ?. You can kill a Bear with a crossbow ?. Weather can affect accuracy ?. Shot placement is vital for success ?. Archery equipment is quiet ?.You need to be able to track your game ?. It cost you $2000 to get into archery ?. A Pellet rifle is awesome ? or did you just want to show off your dog and backyard 🙂

The discussion I initiated here was whether Archery would be useful in a shtf situation and if so I showed how I prepped this cheaply and how to ensure success in a shtf situation being an (experienced) Hunter today would help. If I have missed your point somehow I do apologise Knuckle.

LOL Knuckle I am not sure what to make of your post :).

You always tell a good story and I do enjoy that. But what was the point here ?. You can kill a Bear with a crossbow ?. Weather can affect accuracy ?. Shot placement is vital for success ?. Archery equipment is quiet ?.You need to be able to track your game ?. It cost you $2000 to get into archery ?. A Pellet rifle is awesome ? or did you just want to show off your dog and backyard 🙂

The discussion I initiated here was whether Archery would be useful in a shtf situation and if so I showed how I prepped this cheaply and how to ensure success in a shtf situation being an (experienced) Hunter today would help. If I have missed your point somehow I do apologise Knuckle.

Sorry man...brain farts make the mind wander! 😆

The bow is indeed a good weapon but I doubt that many here will have the patience to get good at hunting with it as the incentive is likely more as a backup than as a hobby. I tried shooting in a few archery lanes in the city with Ratts as he showed me how city folks did things. Many there could outshoot me (including Ratts) as this is their terf and they know it well. But animals don't stand still while you determine the distance and unless you've already killed a few critters with your bow, your going to be losing arrows as you perfect the skills as most of us did along the way too. Ratts later came out gopher hunting with me in farmer's fields where I was more at home...far more fun and you all need to try it!

How many know the difference of shooting a recurve in winter to summer versus the compound? You can at least adjust for the limb's power loss by drawing further on a recurve whereas you can't with a compound. And the power loss is so hard to predict and compensate for. You won't understand the issues though until you try it! I lost many arrows trying to master the winter hunt and failed often. For survival, I suggest you park the bow when winter comes and trap instead.

I used to buy alot of wood shafts and use rubber blunts as they were cheapest throw away arrow I could make. After shooting each arrow, I would bow the shaft by bending it to see if it broke, rotate it and do it again! This is so they don't shatter upon release instead where they might damage my bow or me. High poundage bows are hard on wooden shafts, especially smacking trees intentionally to save losing them in the snow! With all the tricks I knew I still pissed away alot of money, but this was still a hobby I enjoyed so I sucked it up. So whats the bottom line!

Bullets are cheaper and the rifle more reliable!

So were back to the silent aspect as it's main and only selling feature then. Yes, it takes down large game. But many wouldn't even know where to place the arrow either. On a moose your best shot is for the hump as this takes out the front legs and you won't have to walk so far hauling quarters later. I should have maybe mentioned archer's good luck saying we use is "shoot low"! This is a reminder we often give so there will be a blood trail to follow as the wound can then bleed out. We often shoot higher as a precaution for loss of trajectory, yet this aspect is dangerous in bow hunting. No hump shooting with a bow...But to even get close enough for that kill shot the hunter has to master the skill of stalking far better than if you just used a rifle. Animals have a keen sense of smell and so you must learn to mask this stink we carry and also stalk from downwind of the prey.

So much to take in if you are just beginning and much requires a lifetime to perfect. I was still learning daily when I quit... but I now find that I am a far better rifle hunter due to having bow hunted for so long. I used to sit and watch game hit the bait when I guided( and learned so much from such things back then)...the patience I once had is no longer there as I now think of other things I should be doing instead. Seems that life sped up or I'm just slowing down too much as I now spend way too much time on a keyboard instead!

And Although I didn't put much time into scouting this year, I haven't even got my moose with a rifle! It seems that the moose and deer are scarce this year and trappers have mentioned that even the wolves are skinny. This is a bad sign and there is talk of disease maybe being the problem. We once put a bounty on the wolves back in the 70's trying to bring back the deer population and it only made things worse. That is because the wolf often takes the weak and the sick before a disease can spread.... Knowing when not to hunt a species so it can recover is another factor folks might not consider if they aren't initially from here. Last year we were just low on partridge and high on fox numbers! Even nature has cycles.

Now that crossbow might still have potential but I somehow seem to shy from it like it has neon sign attached that reads "rookie who can't master a bow" which shines directly above my head and just out of one's field of vision... I should play with it but haven't quite gotten rid of the bad taste 30 years of archery put there as they are so slow and cumbersome in comparison.

Great read Knuckle :). Thanks for sharing and providing input. We just zeroed our Crossbows last week in the cold snow weather so when we go up north for our last week of hunting we should be set to go. Never thought about or learned about the weather affecting the limb but I guess it makes sense. I guess top advice if using archery into shtf would be to practice archery hunting actively today. You may not have time post shtf.