What off the grid power should i use?? where to buy?

Here is the bad news. There really is no cheap way to go, alternative power wise. Solar is truly expensive. You really shouldn't start it unless you have a minimum 10 thousand to spend. Our system is a quality one...but we are about 17000 into it so far. 20 thousand as a starter unit is more realistic.It will take well over 20 years to pay for itself...and that doesn't cover our hot water wich would be way too much for the system so we have to stay hooked to the grid...or battery replacement every ten years. The good news is that we could live without the grid if push came to shove.

here is some other cheap options. If you have an efficient car (Not prone to overheating) running an inverter off that and an extension cord into the house is cheap.
Another cheap system is the champion 3000 generators out of Canadian Tire which often go on sale for under 300$ (Don't buy at full price) which can easily handle a fridge and freezer.(For that price, you could buy a back up or two) They are not designed to run constantly for months on end but they do the job when the power is down as long as you store and rotate enough gas. But its loud. The car is quieter. As a bonus, You can take the power where you need it. Back side of the property...no problem.

Depends where you are. At the cottage of many years we've never had electricity. Propane runs the fridge, stove and lights. I've started to run some solar to get lights in the summer when it's too hot to run the propane lights. Of course they're only low draw LED lights. Unless you spend a lot of money you can't expect much from solar electricity. Solar can be a great source of heat though for hot water and hot air.
But propane is quite expensive in small tanks, you would need a location where you can put in a large propane tank.

And of course, if your home isn't well insulated, consider isolating/superinsulating one main space with a large heatsink built in, which you can count on to hold warmth for a long time with minimal energy input. There are rules to follow about preventing condensation in an almost airtight room, but it can be done without letting out too much costly heat.
It may sound crazy, but in such a cabin, i'm intending to run a long, prewarming , foodgrade plastic tube out the wall for breathing fresh air in, likely with an oxygen mask, which i'll close up again as needed, and before i go to sleep.
I have to mention the rocket mass heater again, when well designed is about the best you can do with twigs and smallish cuts of wood.

If you're handy with electronics you can make a pretty cheap windmill.

A link that a forum member recently posted in another thread could really help you out...

Solar heating panel from easy to obtain materials. Great DIY project.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bRZvAAqzXIw

A couple of these could REALLY help you heat during the day so you'd only have to worry about firing overnight.

I've heard plenty of good things about on-demand water heaters as well. They go a long way to reducing electricity waste caused by keeping massive 45+ gallon hot water tanks warm 24/7. Granted, that doesn't get you off grid... just helps reduce your consumption.

Solar heating panel from easy to obtain materials. Great DIY project.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bRZvAAqzXIw

That's actually quite cool. Thanks for sharing.

The obvious answer is that since you already have a wood stove why don't you get a thermoelectric generator to place on top of it? This won't power your fridge, however, it would be great for charging a battery which you could use during the evening for a lighting system.

Above is a typical thermoelectric system which has outputs for 5 volts (usb), a 12 volt car power adapter and alligator clips to connect to a 12 volt battery to store your power.

Having a played with a few technologies I strongly believe that using the plentiful, free energy from solar radiation is the way to go. This would include solar heating systems, solar panels to create/store electricity and solar hot water systems. There are plenty of DIY projects for solar heating and solar hot water systems found throughout the web (just like the video above). With respect to general electricity creation I'll take solar over wind any day (that's another topic in and of itself). If you're close to flowing water then I would highly recommend that you consider a hydro electric system. If you really wanted to get wild you could look at a wood burning furnace in conjunction with a solar system to run your pump. I've had one these and their expensive and as that's a factor for you I would seriously entertain creating your own passive solar furnace. They seem to be all the 'rage' lately. Less moving parts means less things likelihood you'll have to fix something.

http://rooftopwind.biz/ I have a friend using this. Works very well.

If your not afraid of a little bilding a gassafier may be a option. It runs on wood or other biomass... heres a really good link of some guys gassafier...he looks like hes got a decent set up to.....
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=a6e3CprVTi8

never thought of the roof top option

thx for posting

I actually would recommend solar electricity as the primary electrical generator for any relatively small house/cottage. Some say it's expensive, I say it's never been cheaper. A typical small cottage can easily run on 1000 watts of solar, which at todays prices is only about $1000. Add the inverter, batteries, etc.. and you can do a real decent expandable system for around $5000.
Use the gas generator as a back-up for extended cloudy days and it can be done. You will still need propane to heat water, cook and maybe even as a back up heater to you wood heat, but that's normal.
People that use solar in this way find it works well. People that try to take their regular house electrical load "off-grid" find that solar doesn't work, or isn't economical, but it's all based on scale. If your electrical consumption per day is (or can be made) low, then go for it.

Sorry Underprepared... i have to disagree with a big chunk of your post.

I live in a smallish townhouse (1100sqft) with other homes on both sides (which should help my heating/cooling costs) and our family tries very hard to conserve our electrical usage. To the extent that i even remove lightbulbs from rooms that don't need them because we're only active in them during daylight hours.

Some examples of what we've done to streamline our house, but maintain a modern living standard:
- just one tv
- just one laptop
- no dishwasher
- on demand water heater
- regularly maintained & cleaned refrigerators and freezers
- heat never set above 20 C
- religious overhead lights usage
- much, much and much more

And even with our extreme efforts, our average consumption is 17KW/day. This is about half of the Canadian average (35KW/day, 1000KW/week, 12,000KW/yr) and quite impressive actually.

I don't see any way a Canadian household/cottage could get by on just 1KW/day. Unless you're essentially living a dark ages lifestyle and only making just enough power to maintain a communications and food storage system.

Even if you heat with wood, cool with passive systems/design, etc... 1kw/day is simply not viable.

Oh, and relying on propane for ANYTHING is a continually increasing risk. The cost is skyrocketing and there are unnecessary dangers with regards to having propane systems in your home.

Oddmott, you misread my reply. 1000 W of solar would provide an average of 4000 w/h per day. The typical "manual defrost" fridge uses around 600 w/h per day.
That leaves around 3400 w/h for other electrical loads.
I do agree with you that it is almost impossible to get the average home electrical usage down to realistic "off-grid" solar numbers though. I don't know why your daily usage is so high, but maybe your fridge and freezer are auto-defrost units. If I were you, I'd take a "kill-a-watt" meter and find out what is drawing so much power. That's kind of off-topic though.

Back to the point – Sapere’s question:

“What would be the best for us now and when TSHTF? Be don't need a huge amount of power and can't afford a lot but would like there to be the ability for expansion/ increased power output.”

Solar is quiet, scalable, modular, and adaptable. It fulfills every one of the criteria in the question.
The suggestion to run a gas generator as a primary electrical source both now and when TSHTF is not realistic. Any other form of electrical generation can not compete.

Solar is quiet, scalable, modular, and adaptable. It fulfills every one of the criteria in the question.
The suggestion to run a gas generator as a primary electrical source both now and when TSHTF is not realistic. Any other form of electrical generation can not compete.

Couldn't have said it better myself. Excellent and I hardly agree.

Generators will only be practical providing you have the knowledge, skills and resources to produce fuels after traditional fuels are no longer available (and you no longer have any).

For diesel generators the means either the creation bio-diesel, or the means to expel vegetable oil on a large scale. I should point out that vegetables oils will solidify in a generator in cold weather rendering them useless. Fuel lines will also have to be modified to prevent deterioration. Bio-diesel really isn't that complicated, however, something you would want to establish the equipment and a skill-set of knowing how to now rather then post-shtf (in my opinion). Both of these methods will require electricity to produce for any decent scale/amount.

For gas generators the only practical option is using what's known as wood gas. This basically heating wood within a container past 400 F. Think of how you would make charred cloth. You can light the hole where the gas is escaping from a charred cloth container and it will ignite. The gases that are created (primarily a combination or atmospheric nitrogen, carbon monoxide and hydrogen) are cooled then can be placed directly into a generator. The spark will ignite it and force the piston around. The trick with this process is calibrating the correct oxygen to fuel ratio within the generator - although there's a lot more to the process then that. Here's a vid I watched some time ago of a guy that has one plugged into a generator (6 kw I believe - which is plenty for any common household). While this particular version is much more complex then what is required to make wood gas work with a generator it is one of the best examples of a wood gas system I've ever seen.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a6e3CprVTi8

CBC reporting on an off grid home in NB.

Features observed in the video: propane appliances, wood stoves, no gypsum drywall, composting toilet, roof mount solar panels, battery storage, passive solar window exposure, and backup generator.

http://www.cbc.ca/player/News/Canada/ID/2649809971/