Self sustainable community-not temporary SHTF community

I have some protocols that must be followed in the selection of my land and one major is that the water cannot be sourced from glaciers, .

Hawk,

I have to ask why no glacier sourced water??? I have been on few glaciers in the Rockies and the water is very good from this old ice. Are you concerned of contamination?? Or that the water source will melt and cease to exist?? I am just curious.

Mountaineer,

The concept of an actual village of like-minded folks sounds very exciting. Currently, without the extra financial resources to buy in. Curious, were you thinking North or South of Hwy #1?? West of Calgary?? Foothills or Prairie?? How big are talking 600 ac, 1800 ac or more?? Surface water - creek, river, lake?? Forested??

I will keep reading because this is very interesting. Modeled on a member only RV park with a focus on self-reliance - power, food, defence???? Hmmmmm.

Mountainman.

Not sure where the property will be or how large; everything depends on number of families interested and funding available from each family. We need to get Mike Holmes on board! 🙂

Sorry, I was commenting on the mountain steps west of Calgary, I was posted To CFB Chilliwack BC back in the 70's and did a fair amount of traveling in Alberta and BC. The country was still rough in that area, but 40 years changes every thing.

Mountaineer,

Here is a quick version of the thought on my mind........(it may take an edit or two to get all down on paper, errr the screen.)

A village of like-minded folks, a butcher, baker and candle-stick maker. As starting a new village may be challenging to establish. What about....

A members only RV Park. Hear me out, please. This would be a private venture and thus less government interference. As a private venture you could select who was qualified to be members.

To start you would need the following members:

Primary Members - those who could afford to invest $50,000 right now. You need x4.
Secondary Members - Those who could afford to invest $5,000 right now. You need x25.
Associate Members - Those who could afford to invest $500 right now. You need x100.

That would give a start up budget of $375,000 to work with.

Next. The property. 120 - 640 acres. Location - TBD. Must have a water source.

Facilities: A RV storage yard - fenced and secured. Campsites - at least 150. Cabin lots at least 12. Self-storage building - with at least 150 units. 5'x10'x8' tall x100. 10'x10'x8' tall x30. 10'x20'x8' tall x20.

Thoughts. The primary members will probably want to build cabins straight away. Good.

The secondary members will want to perminately set-up their RV at a site. Good.

Everyone else will want to store their preps onsite at the storage facility. Very good.

Add to the fact that RV storage will be available.

End result, monthly income from the RV storage and self-storage. Working capital.

The people with the skills may not be the people with the money, conversely the people with the money may not be the ones with the skills.

I will update shortly.

Mountainman.

I have been looking forward to the idea of such a community as well. Some of the factors I have found to be important are of course water and fertile land, but I believe the point about green houses, fish ponds seperate from the water supply and a buffer zone are important too. I like the idea of a design of society set up like a Hutterite colony only more being our own new little town. I have a small mobile home that I would be willing to move to a location in a heartbeat and begin new construction. I have a second one that I live in that has a full length addition and a tin roof covering the entire structure. I have often thought this place could be taken apart and the good materials, new windows etc reconstructed as a new building. Once the new buildings are taking shape the older mobile home could be converted into a refridgerated storage building, work shop, or even just a guest house for people to stay in while they come out to build.

WOW! Mountainman I love the idea. We must have been typing at the same time, but you are thinking on a much higher level. I would be willing to jump in very soon at the $5000.00 level, plus bringing my mobiles and materials to get started. I have a very good resume for such a venture as well. I have building, road and oilfield construction experience and have a degree in Parks and Landscape.

My husband and I are very interested in participating in something like this. It has been a thought for a long time we just never knew how to get the ball rolling. I'm also very interested in the idea of underground living. I would love to get our kids living with just the basic necessities of life. It's important that we teach our young a different way of life other than where it is heading today. We are not too fr south of Calgary and would love to get together with other like minded individuals.

Quietman,

Howdy. Remember this is NOT my project. I am trying to give Mountaineer some ideas.

Mountainman.

Mountaineer,

I will continue.

One BIG advantage to approach this as a private RV park would be that as recreational property money lenders would look favourably at the project. This helps the core project as well as members who may have to borrow funds to get set-up.

Other ideas. This should be a self-sufficient community. Solar power. Wind Power. Micro-hydro. Any other method(s) of keeping off grid power. Composting toilets should be promoted and encouraged. A source of wood shavings would be helpful. If a septic system needs to go in, it must be a very low water system. RV's are already setup to use very low water in the toilet system. Grey water must be kept separate from the black water. So, a grey water system that can be collected from all units to irrigate the grounds, gardens, or have in reserve for fighting fires. A pond system can also be used to filter the grey water.

I agree with quietman, a greenhouse makes sense on so many levels. Self-sufficient at power, water, sewer and food production. An environmentally friendly, self-suffiecient, RV park. Talk about contradiction/paradoxes.

Solar hot water heaters. Windmill water pumps to fill a water reservoir.

Back to other thoughts, sorry this jumps all over.

Another advantage of an RV resort type setup. Until structures could be built post-event, RV's can be lived in. Networking can continue and training could be conducted at the "resort" until time to bugout. And if, the time for bugging out never comes you have a first class location to go and relax with a whole bunch of like-minded folks - who are now your friends.

An advantage of having the onsite storage, is quite straight forward. Being able to store your gear and supplies in a secure on site location allows you to stockpile needed items without having to transport them during a crisis. This mean moving fast and light.

Having primary members living onsite from an early stage means that you have an onsite security force to protect the stored equipment and gear.

This idea may generate a bit of interest and may need to be refined further.

That's it for now. I will need some more feedback, so I can focus the idea further.

Mountainman.

PS - I am in the position to be an associate member at best.

Mountaineer,

A couple other thoughts.

The site would want to have a fuel storage facility (underground, doublewall fuel tanks) - diesel and gasoline and naptha. Gravity feed to fuel hoses.

The property would want to be defendable. No crazy bunkers and sentry towers with razor wire on the perimeter. However, it must be able to be landscaped so that anyone trying to gain access to the property WILL BE detected. IF, needed for a full-time bugout location the resources must be available to increase the defences. A layered defence is the only way to go. Before an event the layers can be landscaped to look very pleasing to the eye. Some layers can do double duty as gardens - I recommend this practice whenever possible.

You would want ONLY one main entrance. An emergency exit would be wise, but it would have to hold out unwanted visitors.

The real estate would want enough drop to be able to have a gravity water, grey water and sewer system.

That's it for now.

Mountainman.

My husband & I would be very interested also... He is a water treatment operator/power engineer, I choose to work at a friends family owned greenhouse...I do organic square foot gardening at our home including herbal/medicinal/tea garden boxes, & a yard that will supply 24 fruits...I study herbal remedy and natural cures,I have learned to depend less on stores and make our own supplies whenever possible such as cleaners, personal hygeine products, laundry products/dish soap...as my friend says "why buy it if you can make it"...I grow, dehydrate/can our food whenever possible, make breads/crackers MRE-type meals etc...I am certified CRSWI/II which means I have a somewhat medical background & experience working with people with physical disabilities/brain injuries (there are all sorts of disabilities that can occur in life)...being in our early 50's we have no children with us (daughter,son-inlaw, grandchildren in NS) and we have much concern over the future and only having each other to deal with whatever happens...we practice sling shot, shooting & archery.

lgsbrooks,

Where were you planning on posting those recipes on laundry soap and the others you spoke of at the meeting?? I think you struck a nerve with those who attended, a good nerve.

Thanks,

Mountainman.

Sorry I took so long to post...It was my weekend to take care of the greenhouse...I will enter these here and there as there are so many of them...really anyone can research ways to do these things, it is just time consuming.

Liquid Laundry Soap about $5 for a 5 Gallon Pail...320 loads @ 1/4 cup per load ( 1/2 cup if really dirty) Lasts me about 2 years or more for 2 adults... if High Efficiency Washer use 1 TBSP per load = about 1140 loads

.Grate (like cheese) 2 bars of Ivory Soap (Fels Naptha soap bars if able to find it from the USA) and put it in a pot with 4 cups of water
.Cook it over MED Heat until melted (do not boil) ...takes about 20 minutes...stir occasionally but go do something else while waiting for it to melt
.Fill a 5 Gallon Bucket 1/2 full of HOT water from the bathtub (it is the easiest way)
.When soap is all melted add it to the bucket with 1/2 cup Borax & 1/2 cup Arm & Hammer Super Washing Soda (get mine and the 5 gallon pail at Home Harware store downtown Brooks)
. Fill the bucket with hot tap water and stir with a yard stick or handle of a hockey stick...lol...put lid on and leave overnight.
. Sometime the next day/afternoon is fine...get the big thing you will stir with and give it a good stir(it gels overnight).
.Either you can pour into other WIDE MOUTH containers to use as you need (you can shake them easily if soap seperates between uses) or just leave the bucket/hockey stick by the washing machine for easy use...I keep an old measuring cup that came with an old purchased box of tide on the lid for measuring.

* This soap is NOT SUDSY...Laurel Sulfate and other ingredients in all the products makes bubbles...people think bubbles means CLEAN, it does not...the ingredients used in all the recipes I'll post make your clothes, body, teeth, hair etc clean...lose the bubbles means clean thought.

I love this soap...it doesn't leave a residue on my clothing...I hang my clothes on the line to dry except in winter ( & I should then too) and noticed other powders do.

I had eczema on the bottoms of my feet for the last 5 years and for the first 2 years they were open bleeding weeping wounds that would not heal and took away my ability to walk, I also stopped smoking during that time and between that and not being able to walk I gained 100 pounds...Dr's would only give me steroid creams for my feet that thinned the skin more so each step I took would cut my feet open and they would bleed and felt like I was walking on broken glass...I decided to not go to the doctor anymore and it has taken me 2 more years to heal myself by changing my body to an alkaline system instead of an acidic one (disease can not live in an alkaline enviroment) and by ceasing to use anything with harsh chemicals in it...so that is why I initially started making my own products..I am able to walk again but am still working on the weight loss issue...I will get there!!!! I know you will love this soap & love taking care of your families needs by yourself!

lgsbrooks,

Thanks for the very quick post. Didn't mean to drag you away from greenhouse duties. 😉

Cheers,

Mountainman.

It's ok Mountainman...I went to the greenhouse and then came home for supper...it rained here all day today so the watering was an easy task...It was a pleasure to meet you yesterday. I'll post some more recipes...perhaps one a day...lol Take care & be good to you & yours!

Hi Folks,

Unfortunately due to time restraints, I cannot respond to everyone individually so please don't think I'm ignoring you. Feel free to PM me.

First I'd like to say that I'm enjoying reading everyone's posts, the ideas are great and it sounds like many folks are on the same page as we are. We understand that not everyone has cash burning a whole in their pocket including my family so that is why it is best to pool our resources to "get more bang for our dollar".

I like the idea of an RV set-up and would probably be most affordable but I'm thinking much grander. Unfortunately my family isn't on the same page and are interested in building a community for the future in which every residence doesn't look the same...we have that in town and we hate it. Keeping this community as affordable as possible, is our goal. I'm thinking about a community in which each family would have at least 1 acre for their residence. I would like to see those who are interested in this idea, come together to help each other build their houses. Will it take lots of time and hard work? Definitely but it will be rewarding in the end. It will bring us together as a community, teaching the younger generations something that they can't learn from a textbook. 🙂 The only thing we would have to do is purchase the material to build the houses and the land. Hopefully we have some folks with backgrounds in the trades necessary to pull this off so it will be done right and save us some money doing everything without hiring a builder. Building this type of community, utilizing free labor and the guidance of experience trades people, will help families who wouldn't normally be able to afford a real home, get one and be proud of it because they helped build it with their hands.

OR Option #2

Depending on how many people are interested, we could approach a "prefab" builder to get a large group discount if he wants our business. I'm not talking about a house trailer, I'm talking about a home which requires a foundation. (option for those who can afford it)

Any comments on either of these ideas? If you don't feel comfortable posting a reply here, feel free to PM me and I'll respond as soon as I can.

Repost from Ontario section, group retreat/prepper community purchase
I found an eco village website that seems to be built along similar lines to what is being proposed. This community/neighbourhood is relatively self sufficient so you may be able to get some idea's from the site to further encourage more discussion and planning. All input on this topic (and the other thread/s along this line) is awesome....keep going
FYI "Earthsong Eco-neighbourhood" link (they are located in New Zealand, but there are others in Canada - some religious, some environmental)
http://www.earthsong.org.nz/about/sustainability.html