Mountainman posted a very interesting item back in November, from a guy calling himself Hillbilly:

http://internationalpreppersnetwork.net/viewtopic.php?f=13&t=1065&p=27399&hilit=katrina+lessons#p27399

I found it a fascinating read, especially the attitude of some of the FEMA stormtroopers when moving people. The guy who casually advised shooting your pets would have had a very nasty response from me! There would have been shooting, alright, but not my pets!!

I love FEMA and Government planning for emergencies since they have our best interest in mind. Whatever government wants to do and legislate is ok by me. Prepping being looked at in a negative light by government is crazy since government would not do such a thing. We pay their wages so the government would ok our freedom to prepare, although preparing is stupid because the government does it for us already. Questioning their ability or intention may be seen as anti-government which I am not. In fact I am sewing my very own brown shirt. Yay government, I love you!

I love FEMA and Government planning for emergencies since they have our best interest in mind. Whatever government wants to do and legislate is ok by me. Prepping being looked at in a negative light by government is crazy since government would not do such a thing. We pay their wages so the government would ok our freedom to prepare, although preparing is stupid because the government does it for us already. Questioning their ability or intention may be seen as anti-government which I am not. In fact I am sewing my very own brown shirt. Yay government, I love you!

Well Gravlore we really are on the same page.

I always thought that prepping is being independent from government.
We pay them (government) so they have our own interest??????? O MY GOD.
Never hear of the horror story from every disaster about fema?
Just try to deal with government now under normal conditions and you will go banana.
Henry Just my experience dealing with government agencies lately.

I always thought that prepping is being independent from government.
We pay them (government) so they have our own interest??????? O MY GOD.
Never hear of the horror story from every disaster about fema?
Just try to deal with government now under normal conditions and you will go banana.
Henry Just my experience dealing with government agencies lately.

Henry - he was joking!! 🙂

I would like to add this - we're all very quick to point a finger and say what's wrong with the government when it comes to emergency preparedness and response, but how many of the general population actually take the governments request for 72 hour self-sufficiency to heart (at least in Canada: http://www.getprepared.gc.ca/ and US: http://www.ready.gov/ ) . Don't get me wrong, I can see the flaws in the reality of events past as well as the next person, but if we as a society took our social obligations a little more seriously and had that 72 hour preparedness across the country, then maybe the government and their agencies could focus on the bigger issues rather than helping people out with initial panic.

I remember stories my family elders would talk about war-time and how people were encouraged by government to create Victory Gardens, and save money in the form of bonds. While I don't want to derail us and start a discussion on bonds, I'm trying to say the government told people to make gardens and save their money, and while far from perfect, you did not hear about the breakdown in society to the degree we have now. Maybe that's just an overall lack of respect that many of today's generation have.

I think it's safe to say that everyone on this forum is looking to have a higher level of preparedness than most, but I feel many in the general population are like ostriches, sticking their head in the sand and doing nothing, then blaming the government very vocally for not feeding, sheltering and protecting them in a time of need.

I guess having seen the work the military did to help restore power and help people out during the Ice Storm of 98, I can no longer completely slam the government. I won't be depending on them, but especially in Ontario, I've seen where it has worked too.

I think we can all agree that government agencies have some degree of use, especially for the completely unprepared.
The issue should not be why they fail, as there are many reasons...corruption, ineptitude of leaders, being overwhelmed by the scope of an event, etc.
The fact remains that even the government tells the public that they are on their own for the first 3 days.
This time frame is used as a buffer time to be able to access a devastated area.
Roads may be out, supplies need to be moved..it just takes time in many cases.
I too remember the ice storm, and yes, they did come in and help...but simply by gathering the unprepared up and shuffling them off to the shelters, where, they were probably better off than sitting in their unheated homes with a freezer full of spoiled processed mechanically separated mystery meat, a rancid jar of mayo in the fridge, and a can of soup in the cupboard that they couldn't heat up!
Setting up shelters in school gymnasiums is fine, but they can only house, feed, and take care of so many for so long.
Not their fault necessarily, just a fact of life. Public disaster plans do work for some people to some degree, but resources are limited and supplies, no matter how well stocked will eventually run out.
I look at it this way...
the more able bodied people that prepare to take care of themselves, the more disabled, elderly, truly needy people with real needs for help can be helped by those agencies.

I believe this quote from the Katrina survivor partially sums up the idea I've brought to the forum:

"06. Self-reliance seems to draw suspicion upon you from the authorities. I've mentioned this in a previous e-mail, but I've had many more reports of it from those who survived or bugged out, and it bears re-emphasizing. For reasons unknown and unfathomable, rescue authorities seem to regard with suspicion those who've made provision for their safety and have survived (or bugged out) in good shape. It seems to be a combination of "How could you cope when so many others haven't?", "You must have taken advantage of others to be so well off", and "We've come all this way to help, so how dare you not need our assistance?" I have no idea why this should be the case... but there have been enough reports of it that it seems to be a widespread problem."

It goes on to say that a prepper could face more than just suspicion, in worst case scenarios it could be confiscation of property, unlawful searches, and detainment.

Most troubling is that this could happen close to home, before a disaster. In the case of Ontario's Bruce Beach, of National Geographic fame, he's been raided by authorities over the years for his prepping activities, without a clear motive.

I know a little about emergency management in Ontario. In the end it is about protecting life, property and exercising due diligence. The continent wide government love affair with the 72 hour emergency kit was something that was spawned by Katrina. Governments realized that no matter how well planning was done if the if the emergency or disaster was big enough there were just not enough resources to help everyone. Some measure of self help was needed. Hence the development of the arbitrary 72 hour emergency kit. Governments encouraged people to prepare a kit and due diligence was done. If it is a small scale disaster, a flood, forest fire, water plant failure, extreme weather event or chemical spill for example, Ontarians can definitely count on their government(s) to take charge and save the day. If it is a widespread major disaster involving large populations then you are likely on your own.

However anyone who has considered the possibilities or headed the governments call and has a 72 hour emergency kit is a prepper in my eyes. It is a pity that many involved in emergency management do not take their own advice as more than a few do not even have their own 72 hour kit! Most of us here aspire to be prepared for a period of more than 72 hours but we all have to start somewhere.

I had tried to touch on this earlier in the post "lessons learned from Katrina" perhaps the title was a little dated, but the points above are absolutely correct. its obvious by looking at the "views" for each post there are people out there that look but may not feel compelled to take action or prep. The interest is there. I just wanted to give a quick history lesson from Katrina in the sense that these are disatatsers / events with some warning.
As a government employee in a role considered 'essential" it is saddening to see the lack of planning prompted by an employer that will require its employees even more when disatser strikes. When something happens i will be "required" to stay and continue working. Who will look after my personal needs away from work? Only me, but Im at work, not home, therefore i began to prep. People "required" at work will also be "required at home" decisions will be made by those employees that need to take on a responder / mitigation role. What will there choice be? Stay at work? Go home to the kids?

One more thing, the asteroid in Russia, was there warning to them? Was it considered to be a non threat? Hmmmm.
Case in point.
Whats that light in the sky over there???
Gotta go...

Actually this was a meteoroid not an asteroid. Meteoroids are small rocks or particle of debris that range in size from dust to around 10 metres in diameter. Larger objects are usually referred to as asteroids.

It is extremely unlikely that they would have any warning for something this size.

Wrong word, sorry, i am at work and trying to look as though i am "at work". LOL. My point, if that was the middle of my town, your town, Toronto, Hamilton etc. How would we do? S*%t happens...

A wise man once said "It may never happen. Best to be prepared just in case.". ( A little shout out to ICRCC)

Actually this ties in quite nicely to the theme of this thread. This meteor incident would definitely qualify as a local disaster an no doubt the locals have some kind of emergency plan that was activated. However this plan was undoubted impacted by the secondary loss of cell service. It was just reported by the BBC that cell service in the area was down for some time. This was a result of everyone trying to use their cell phones to contact family and friends which proved too much for the infrastructure. That has happened a couple of times in my area during the summer when there is heavy traffic and there is a bad accident along the HWY 11 corridor the cell service often goes down due to excessive use.

We should all keep that in mind that if there is a disaster we may not be able to contact our family and friends using cell phones immediately following the incident.

If we're sharing lessons learned, I have two:

1) The Ice Storm of 98: Most people and agencies were very cooperative but there were two issues seen repeatedly - 1) Generators would go missing in the middle of the night and were probably the #1 theft item in Eastern Ontario at that time. Thankfully some good Samaritans would put their generators in the back of their trucks and go door to door with their neighbours and give them an hour or two to help pump out basements (sump pumps weren't running) or power fridges/freezers for a short time; and 2) fuel for the generators - the army was taking over diesel trucks to power their equipment so those with large generators sometimes had issues getting fuel (thankfully, the company I worked for at the time had a facilities manager with family at CP Rail and they helped us secure tractor trailer sized generators and fuel to keep our facilities from freezing

2) The Northeast Blackout: Lots of businesses and people had generators, but there were many that had not taken the step to get them wired in properly. At the business I worked at (rhymed with "Hortel"), I was in a role that let me see all the business continuity plans play out and during that time, there were massive generators to power the computer servers but we had to take out a window to bring the cables in to the nearest distribution panel that needed the power - they didn't have a way at the time to isolate the power to what was needed at the main distribution site.

So I learned - have a source of backup power, ensure you can have it run in a crisis (ie. enough fuel), and be able to use that power conveniently for the items that really need it.