Dial up .....need I say more. 😉
Nothing else available out in the boonies or way up in the mtns..
Hey... we are lucky to have hydro here...well most of the time 😆

Dial up .....need I say more. 😉
Nothing else available out in the boonies or way up in the mtns..
Hey... we are lucky to have hydro here...well most of the time 😆

And I have often thought of moving to BC as it is closer to Calgary and all my kids. I used to have dialup and it is still used for upload here but cost almost the same as satellite does and this is therefore the closest I can get to having city options. We waited for years for satellite to come up as an option thru Bell and it has it's limits still. We can watch still tv when it's snowing or raining here as the signal comes down somewhere else as our satellite tv goes down but internet often stays. :geek: Hmmmm.

Seems Ukraine has a new twist which keeps the aid from reaching those in the east. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J1i9cKbcWt0
Seems the rebels hit a convoy of refugees with rocket fire from weapons supplied to the by Russia. Seems them rebels have to quit doing the west's dirty work and conveniently killing more civilian's for them. And the rebels always do it exactly when west Ukraine benefits most......there are just unlucky it seems! Pretty soon there won't be any need to bring in food for those in the east anyways as they don't seem to want to stay alive long enough to survive the bureaucracy.

Ok, so a week goes by and finally Russia's aid is allowed into the Ukraine. It was there that the Red Cross was supposed to oversee the distribution of the aid after Ukraine searched it all. Now that they trucks are rolling within Ukraine, the Red Cross states they won't accompany the trucks as Ukraine government won't promise them safe conduct and states they still view the trucks as an direct invasion. Kuddo's to those drivers for continuing into what might possibly be setup of sorts.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kj14OVWeip4

Euro News states in this earlier video that Red Cross were in place and that the trucks were undergoing customs checks before they proceeded.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gJuEOyCdlo4
They also state that Russia claims Kiev was intentionally holding up the delivery which means that Russia is therefore complying to all Ukraine's demands on this matter.

Here is Reuters perspective on this story https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=naY-HLfS6qo
They claim that this is a rebel controlled border crossing and suggest that these trucks are truly a trojan horse entering Ukraine. Their leave the viewer feeling that Russia has crossed without Ukrainian permission although they do mention that Ukraine stated they won't attack the convoy.

I hope they let them unload and leave without any incident as these news agencies leave much to misinterpretation regarding this latest event.

Russia's Ambassador answers question in English to media as they admit they decided to go ahead as Ukraine continued to denied them access they previously agreed to with Red Cross supervision.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eFY7atJ3bCM

This press conference asks many very direct questions which in turn gives us better insights as to the Russian perspective of this whole affair. It seems that Ukraine sent 58 representatives to that border crossing along with all the Red Cross. All trucks were presented for random inspection from the 16th til now and from what is mentioned, few come forth to perform an inspection. All of this was done under the watchful eye of the Red Cross. This lack of proper inspection thus allows Ukraine to continue to claim this convoy a trojan horse instead of an act of humanitarian aid....bet you can't find this on local TV programming?

Looks like some trucks already made it to their destination https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yeD1fDppR-4

So what's new with east Ukraine. Seems that Poroshenko is now willing to meet with the rebel leader at least. Suggestions are that with US facing events in Iraq and the EU unwilling to meet more stringent sanctions on Russia, Putin has gotten the two to at least sit down together. The rebels demands seem to be a middle ground where they even remain with Ukraine but have special recognitions.... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EYClQiUfqb4

This would likely allow the east to benefit from the extraction of resources and allow the west to get on with their plans to provide for Europe. Likely Russia won't be as threatened as with their being totally cut off as originally intended as the rebels want to keep their affiliations ongoing with Russia.... you have to admit this could be a way out for both sides. It is obvious Russia doesn't want war.

Might not be such a good deal for those others who do want war though as a lot of preparation and planning went into creating this dilemma. I'd bet this creates division amongst the EU's partners as public pressure forces them to opt for a peaceful resolution to undo painful sanctions that will further destabilize their already unstable economies. If the majority don't opt for peace, then you can bet things are alot uglier economically than what is being presented daily. This option allows present governments to pass immediate blame of their failing economy to be put on Russia as hyper inflation would soon follow worldwide at the commencement of a major war.

So what's new with east Ukraine. Seems that Poroshenko is now willing to meet with the rebel leader at least. Suggestions are that with US facing events in Iraq and the EU unwilling to meet more stringent sanctions on Russia, Putin has gotten the two to at least sit down together. The rebels demands seem to be a middle ground where they even remain with Ukraine but have special recognitions.... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EYClQiUfqb4

This would likely allow the east to benefit from the extraction of resources and allow the west to get on with their plans to provide for Europe. Likely Russia won't be as threatened as with their being totally cut off as originally intended as the rebels want to keep their affiliations ongoing with Russia.... you have to admit this could be a way out for both sides. It is obvious Russia doesn't want war.

Might not be such a good deal for those others who do want war though as a lot of preparation and planning went into creating this dilemma. I'd bet this creates division amongst the EU's partners as public pressure forces them to opt for a peaceful resolution to undo painful sanctions that will further destabilize their already unstable economies. If the majority don't opt for peace, then you can bet things are alot uglier economically than what is being presented daily. This option allows present governments to pass immediate blame of their failing economy to be put on Russia as hyper inflation would soon follow worldwide at the commencement of a major war.

So, Russian Tv again, nice. Anyways, separatists want to have their own army inside Ukraine, that's ridiculous. And so are you when you say that they are seeking middle ground. By presenting unacceptable conditions for any sovereign government all they are doing is to pretend that they want to negotiate so they can blame it later on the government. Since the beginning of the unrest in the east, the provisional government offered separatists concessions. This is from an article on Voice of America from Apr 11th, 2014:

<<<<Prime Minister Arseniy Yatsenyuk and other top Ukrainian government officials traveled to the city of Donetsk, where they met Friday with eastern Ukrainian governors and mayors, as well as other influential eastern Ukrainian figures, including tycoon Rinat Akhmetov, Ukraine's richest man.

The acting prime minister said he supported amending Ukraine’s constitution and changing laws to devolve power.
Such a proposal would mean that regional governors and their administrations would no longer appointed by the central government, and regional referendums would be permitted.

Addressing another concern of Russian-speaking residents in eastern Ukraine, Yatsenyuk also promised that no one would be allowed to “limit the Russian language and the right to speak it in Ukraine.”>>>

http://www.voanews.com/content/prorussian-separatists-face-friday-deadline-in-eastern-ukraine/1891069.html

What suggestions are you talking about? This sounds like your trying The power of Suggestion on us again. If not, please be more specific and present credible sources.

So prom, when you choose to listen to Voice of America, do you not often wonder why they don't focus on events such as Biden's conflict of interest? How about the blocking of the Russian aid convoy? When in the past was there so much controversy over bringing in aid? They just had to look in the trucks and let it through. It wasn't going to the rebels but to the starving citizens.

The job of the media is to bring the public the news. In the past they used to battle for the right to have that hot story out before the competition did. We all know that the media in North America is now controlled by the government as this type of thing never happens anymore. I can see the spin that RT applies too, but yet they still do a more honest job than that of our own country nowadays because they show what we weren't seeing and back it up with visual proof, not just talk. I have pointed this out time and again and yet you still try to paint me with the opposition card.

Prove they are lying and I will listen. I've continually presented "real evidence" to back up my stand. Why is it that the pro-Russians have always been the ones dying in every situation while the news portrays them as trouble makers and terrorists? When have they gone to the west killing in retaliation? Why do they not kill many of those soldiers they capture instead of showing them the destruction they've caused? Why do the people of the east hide when the Ukraine army goes thru but come out when the rebels are there as shown in videos?

Your news article is far less believable than that which I present daily because it proves nothing. No video footage of the event. No showing this event ever happened. That's not proof, just supposition. I'm sure there wouldt be a video of this event if it did occur as they'd be plastering it everywhere for the world to see otherwise.

I further followed up with prom's answer as to why I often follow RT's news under the Power of Suggestion thread found here as it seemed better suited to this region. http://www.internationalpreppersnetwork.net/viewtopic.php?f=67&t=5112&start=30

It does seem that Putin is being accredited with the present ceasefire that Ukraine should now be experiencing. I haven't seen anything on our local news yet showing this so I'll assume RT is the first to mention it. Putin has a 7 step plan to this peace that I can't imagine Ukraine can afford Step 7 for quite some time. It sounds good in the news but doesn't likely fit reality. Yes prom, I'm figuring that there is some BS here, but more likely from Putin than RT ... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WTeTBG6eYA4

I haven't seen this on the tv as yet but found this one the web from the US https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lt1ogC7biRo
Obama doesn't claim to know why the cease fire exists but states Russia must stop meddling. Otherwise you can see he stays intentionally vague on the topic. This vagueness was the same tactic used with the humanitarian convoy and portrays to me that were unprepared for this ceasefire and thus being vague is the response for today.

Well, it seems that Ukraine is already flip-flopping over the ceasefire. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SqEP5v6TtRg

Poroshenko has also applied for NATO membership knowing it forces NATO to accept if they don't want to lose east Ukraine to Russia. Seems some even decipher the tweet from Poroshenko to suggest he was carefully continuing to blame Russia even while they discussed the ceasefire. Therefore maybe this ceasefire might just be a stall tactic and ploy for Ukraine to be accepted into NATO and thus obtain NATO backing.

Just when things started to look up too! Now it seems Routers states that NATO plans on performing exercises in west Ukraine which mean NATO will officially have boots on the ground. Now it is likely both major players already have people in Ukraine but this will officially mark the start of the inevitable direct conflict between the super powers as land conflict will eventually include air support and then naval support too. Meanwhile, you should ask yourself, who really will be the cause of this eventual confrontation? Seem another impossible trap may have been set for Russia to step into.

And yet why push Russia at such a time when ISIS is strutting all their new US weaponry and getting stronger daily? They've shown they now possess skud missiles, 50 GPS guided artillery pieces, tanks and Blackhawk helicopters and 1,500 Humvees. ISIS has no patience with continual attacks and grows stronger daily. The more pies that you have your hands in , the less likely that they will all come our right... Are they hoping that ISIS will eventually become a threat to Russia too? Maybe ISIS only wants to piss off those that tried to control them...but then all this new equipment may have unforeseen obligations attached to it's acquisition as another possible CIA venture to destabilize the region!

Perhaps it would be fair to mention that the NATO Ukraine peace keeping exercises are held regularly since 2006 as the most trusted news agency says in this article:

<<The Ukrainian-American exercises have taken place in Lvov since 2006 under the framework of NATO's broader 'Partnership for Peace,' which Ukraine is part of. >>

http://rt.com/news/184624-us-military-drill-ukraine/

But hey, why bother with details like this if they are not good for the cause.

The rest of your post is speculations like usual. And btw, while they were discussing cease fire in Minsk, Putin sent more military to help the russian troops already spending their vacation in Ukraine ( http://www.aljazeera.com/news/europe/2014/08/ukraine-rebels-say-russia-troops-among-forces-201482882338716351.html ) .

Perhaps it would be fair to mention that the NATO Ukraine peace keeping exercises are held regularly since 2006 as the most trusted news agency says in this article:

<<The Ukrainian-American exercises have taken place in Lvov since 2006 under the framework of NATO's broader 'Partnership for Peace,' which Ukraine is part of. >>

http://rt.com/news/184624-us-military-drill-ukraine/

But hey, why bother with details like this if they are not good for the cause.

The rest of your post is speculations like usual. And btw, while they were discussing cease fire in Minsk, Putin sent more military to help the russian troops already spending their vacation in Ukraine ( http://www.aljazeera.com/news/europe/2014/08/ukraine-rebels-say-russia-troops-among-forces-201482882338716351.html ) .

These articles are good finds and they are both decent reads. The NATO exercise is near the polish border which should be therefore less threatening at a time when tensions are already high. I earlier suggested that both sides likely have players in action but not officially. Russia and the US both deny their presence, but we know they are likely there. The 2nd article is more assumption than fact as would be expected. We know that Russia is likely sending them but they state that they are volunteers and thus not being paid for their participation. These are convenient stories which can be told by either side when captured. So far, the threat of capture is less dangerous as many seem to be returned after proof of their capture is documented. Likely others are still shot though and so therefore there is some risk in capture.

The thread is about hunger in Donetsk, which means it is about those Ukrainians from the east and their current situation. I've tried to keep the links here along their present situation and the analysis of possible scenarios playing out, etc, more in the psychology thread. I know they interconnect in so many ways due to using this conflict as a daily example creates that aspect of crossover.

The plight of those people living in this region during all this conflict is ongoing. It is becoming obvious that any major confrontation will likely occur in this region and thus 14 million people will have to bear the brunt because Russia can't support that many refugees and all know it. I often think many folks forget that fact when watching things unfold during this conflict. Therefore the percentage of deaths is still low but necessities like food and water are now reaching a critical state. These 14 million people have now been reduced to dependency on others to provide even these basics.

- How can you feed your family while hiding in basements?

- Why are those in the west so adamant to stop Russian aid from reaching those in the east?

- How long could Russia maintain such a quest alone?

- Why isn't our news giving any mention to this obvious growing problem?

As I've pointed out before, it is obvious that the UN and NATO are hiding many aspects of this current crisis. And I will remind all again.... I DO NOT SIDE WITH RUSSIA ... I just dislike the fact that my side is supporting actions that are less than honourable , all in the name of capitalism, not in the name of democracy as our governments so often proclaim!

If the plight of these people of east Ukraine are ignored, soon they will start dying from starvation or disease from unsanitary conditions. And when they do, most likely we will point the finger at Russia again and proclaim this is also their fault. Meanwhile, we will conveniently forget that we could have sent them aid as we often publicize having done so with other nations because we are the nice guys. It appears to not be in our best interests to help these folks and so our news seems to forget this aspect when reporting events in this region.

Details such as this seem to go unnoticed by us and this fact is what Russia in turn is trying to capitalize on. Putin is using this aspect to increase his popularity that our side continually denies. Putin's aid convoy showed other nations such as China and India that he is the more just in this conflict. Many will ignore that Russia is supporting those in the east because he is also standing against the obvious tyranny that is holding this country hostage these days. When an all out war does come to pass as it seems some are so avidly promoting, the UN will then finally have to admit to us that Russia has half or more of the world's population backing them, but no worries, right?

I found this English explanation of the eastern Ukraine perspective regarding their overall stand against the west. It may give you better insight as to why they chose to separate and why the language barrier is such an important factor. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fvkVhDyZP3Y

(and I put this article here as I am not dissecting it, just presenting it.)

Russia sent 2nd convoy into Ukraine without official permission after waiting another week at the border https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qFMPcwPNO28
Seems no one searched these trucks so there will eventually be some fallout over this matter too.

Knuckle, others have said they are not interested in your utbe links. I will go further and say I am not interested in anyones utube vids. I have always thought they dumb down a site as they try to pass for content and thought. If utube vids are anyones arguement to anything...well they have nothing. Think I am wrong go for a internet tour of some sites...90% links and utube vids or endless cut and paste articals trying to pass for substance, but highlighting the lack of it.
Posts without links may have my attention as something original or thoughtful may be present.

With that said (I sure hope I was not ambigous) , This hunger in Donetsk is not about hunger, anymore more than food is the answer, well it may be the answer to those who are hungry, but its not like they matter. This is entirely about regenal domanance, and Nato expansion... as was Georgia.
The people east or west did not want to fight each other in urban warfare, despite the language conflict, reginal dissparity such as heavy industry in the east, agriculture more dominant in the west they were getting by and along, with problems for sure.... Every person there knows the cost of war, they have had plenty, read any history book about that piece of realistate.
Other interests besides people, have no problem with war.
What I find amazzing is that Putin hasnt driven down south cutting off the east and gaining a land bridge to Crimiea.I would have already done so in his shoes.
Open any atlas, look at the Panama canal, now imagine Russia (or China) helping to overthrow a the Panamainian Government, and talking about a Military alliance....Look at that atlas....Think the USA world not have to act. Look at that atlas again, Find Ukraine, for you Americans its not in Northamerica you will have to flip a few pages, Take a good look, now imagine your Putin, and you look west and up and you can see all the Nato countries there, And even if your not a parranoid Russan you know Nato is just another tool for American foriegn policy, Like the IMF, (you did know that right?) So whats the bear to do? well again if you have read any history book you know Ukraine is a absolute trip wire for the bear, No less so than the panama canal for the USA.
The fact Putin hasnt taken the east yet has me wondering if for the moment he isnt content to just keep things on simmer, thus depribing Ukraine of its eastern industrial production and the much needed revenue, to the benifit of his own industrial base,and to help hobble Ukraine and lesson its value to the west and increase the cost associated should the the west further encroch, and lets not forget fully fracture the country east west if the west keeps pushing.This is all one giant chess game, and I absolutly have to hold my sides in when I see posts about CME, and sun activity, when you do not have to look off world to find serious threats than can turn hot (as in thermo nuclear)faster than you can say pass the perrogies.
As for the hungry...well does either side care?...I quess so...if it serves thier interests...for now.

As to utube vids, When tanks roll south to take the east I am sure they will roll over enough villages so there can be lots of utube vids that show just how savage the Ukraine forces are...Know what im saying Vern. Think not? read some history books.