Wow, great thread so far. But I think I can contribute a few useful pieces of information. There are a number of comments in this thread thrown out from those who don't know... that's a little dangerous.

I am in the process of getting my ham license and so know a few basics. First off the "scrambling" or "sub channel codes" on FRS radios is purely for convenience, it does NOTHING for security. A good quality FRS radio (like what search and rescue uses) or common radio scanner or a HAM radio will pick up ALL communication from FRS/GMRS regardless of configuration.

That brings up the second point. Most ham radios have a much wider receiving capability than transmit, primarily due to the legal implications. You are free to receive (listen) to most any frequency without your license (some exceptions for protected frequencies for analog cell phones and such). Many handhelds now receive on any frequency from 500kHz to 999.990MHz. Example: http://radioworld.ca/amateur-handheld-amateur-radios-vx-8dr-p-7133.html

So your privacy will not be protected by selecting a marine radio vs FRS vs CB vs VHF. Only your "channel crowding" may be reduced (less people transmitting on those channels). So don't think you have less likelihood of being heard with any one radio vs another.

Alright, time for some rhetorical questions to stimulate your thoughts! Why do you think the Ham Radio license requires more learning/testing? Why do we even have a license? Why are good ham radios more expensive than FRS/GMRS/CB radios? Its because with power comes responsibility! And with power/quality hardware comes price! There is no two ways about it. If you want maximum flexibility, maximum "reach" with your radio, reliable operation from portable power, you want Ham Radio. That's what its designed for. Yes it takes some knowledge/skill and practice (don't most valuable prepper capabilities?) and yes it will cost some money (again like everything else in the world). So don't shy away from ham radio due to requirements, make the choice based on your realistic needs and available time/money budget.

Many families still choose to use FRS/GMRS for simplicity and teaching the significant other and/or kids, but ham radio will provide more capabilities if you take the time to learn how to use it. Also, another note under Canadian law you may use any means of radio communication necessary in a life or death emergency situation. Many ham radios can be altered to open up the FRS frequency capabilities on a HAM handset. It is ILLEGAL to use your ham radio to transmit on these frequencies normally, but many make the modification and have this capability reserved for use in the event of a life or death situation (ie: earthquake in BC) or similar to contact their family who may being using cheaper FRS handsets.

Also under Canadian law the maximum transmit power allowable is 1000W with your ADVANCED license (I saw suggestions for 2000-5000W early in the thread). The limitation on a Canadian Basic ham license is 250W for most bands, less for some. Again in a life or death situation you may exceed this, but are you going to invest in expensive equipment you can't use or practice with on a regular basis? (Some do for their base station at home, but you have to be thousands of $$$ invested by that point.)

Hopefully that stimulates some thoughts and gets you thinking about your options. I personally would recommend starting with a family set of FRS radios on the cheap, then working towards your ham radio license and adding one or more $200-500 handsets to your collection unlocked for FRS use in an emergency, then lastly get a HF radio for long distance comms. The price goes up for each one of these steps as does the level of proficiency required to operate it.

In this scenario I wasn't intimating that GMRS with scrambled channels would not be heard by others... only that it would be more difficult to understand what was being said. As well with marine band radios... the fact that there would be so few of them in use on land would mean that there would be much fewer stations to inadvetantly hear or interfere with your comms as opposed to CB. IF one is talking about high performance civilian or military comms, monitoring, descrambling and direction finding then you would be toast no matter what you could access. Just my 2 cents.

I'm in the process of studying to take the test for my HAM license. I would love to see this discussion continue, and to know if anything materializes from it.

BCPrepGirl,

Since you are taking your course, please, use this thread to inform us of what you are learning on the course and what type of radio rig would be of use to the majority who visit here.

Thanks,

Mountainman.

Hi BCPrepGirl, I live in Langley. You can PM me if you're interested in discussing/practicing/learning together. You might consider a course too. Many radio clubs offer a licensing course in the fall for about $100 +/- $25 (some include extras like books or more hours of instruction so the price varies).

Also, I already bought my first radio! A 'wouxun kg-uv6d'. Highly recommended for new learners and preppers. This radio is physically capable of all VHF/UHF ham frequencies including FRS, GMRS, MURS, NOAA Weather channels, Marine Channels, Forest Service frequencies, Commercial Radio (ie: warehouses, security guard companies, trucking/courier companies, etc...). It also has an FM radio tuner (listen to music! or emergency notices after an event. 🙂 It has great sound quality/volume and is IP55 water resistant (rain ok, swimming/diving not ok). It also has a small LED flashlight built in. Not an amazing light, but a good second backup in an emergency kit. I will likely bring it along to any meetups in the lower mainland bc if I get out to one...

Other nice features this radio has that a prepper might want:
- Charging base can work off 110v at home, or 12v in your car
- You can remove the rechargeable battery and pop-in a AA battery pack for emergency use (store some AA lithiums in your kits)
- You can remove the antenna (1) for compact storage, 2) attach a bigger/better antenna when space permits like at home or in your vehicle, reattach the small compact antenna for mobile use)
- You can attach an external headset (hide radio in your bag, use a discreet headset that looks like your listening to music)

If you purchase the "amateur version" it will have the transmit locked down to the ham radio bands only. If you purchase the "commercial version" it will be wide open (can transmit on all of the above). DISCLAIMER: Please note the ham radio license only permits you to transmit on the ham channels, commercial radios are licensed by Industry Canada to businesses/organization for specific frequencies/channels and it is unlawful to transmit on frequencies you are not licensed for (although permitted by law during a life threatening emergency). Many preppers get an 'unlocked commercial version' for such emergencies as they are cheap enough you can buy one and throw it into your "earthquake kit". Just don't get caught transmitting out of band or you can face consequences. (Mostly if you interfere with regular operations of something like forestry/trucking/fire fighting/etc then they will hunt you down! The money these companies/organizations pay for licensing partially goes towards Industry Canada enforcement of frequency allocations.)

Lots of guys take these little radios into the "back country" as your only hope of someone hearing you in an emergency will be forest service channels and it doesn't require a subscription service (ie: spot messenger, satellite phones, etc). You can't legally transmit on the forest service channels normally, but if it were a serious emergency you might find it appropriate.

Likewise if you like to take a kayak/canoe/small raft out in the open water, you might like access to the Marine channels. Again listening is a-ok (and helpful to hear the big boats talking to shore) but transmitting with a non-marine radio on marine channels is not ok (except in a life threatening emergency).

This goes back to the misunderstanding about Marine radio vs. ham vs. commercial. None are more secure or less likely to be heard. They are simply "allocations" of frequencies for the sake of organization/standardization by governments. This radio is a cheap $160 chinese radio and is physically capable of receive/transmit on all of the above! This is not "high performance" or "millitary" - its just cheap offshore stuff you can order on ebay! Most anyone who is prepped enough to have a radio better than FRS/GMRS will also be prepped enough to be able to at least listen in on marine channels, etc...

Elrond,
Have you tested the range yet?
How far can you communicate with this set with and without repeater use?

Denob: I can't really test the range yet, I haven't actually completed my license yet. It's kinda like buying a car before you have a drivers license. 😉 Totally legal, but just not that satisfying yet. I'm just driving around in parking lots if you know what I mean. 😆

But I have been doing lots of listening and scanning to see what I can pickup. I'm in langley, bc and I can listen in on radio nets from vancouver island and salt spring island, north van, surrey, langley, chilliwack and down into the states a ways (don't know the club, but everyone checking in had american callsigns - all bc callsigns start with VE7 or VA7). These nets are generally all conducted via a repeater (so a relatively good antenna relatively high up - ironically usually with low-ish power as the height means they don't need a lot).

I have also listened in to some simplex radio nets for emergency groups (simplex means one frequency for transmit & receive from radio to radio, almost exclusively not using repeaters). In surrey they have an emergency radio net weekly which starts on a repeater, then as an exercise they move to a simplex frequency and continue (forces you to practice changing frequencies/channels with your equipment). Langley does the same with their emergency radio net.

I have also compared it directly with my brothers FRS radio. Not only is the transmit significantly more powerful, but the receive is way better too. My brothers FRS radio has the weather channels. We were up in the backcountry around kamloops and his radio was rather fuzzy on the weather channel while mine was crystal clear. This will likely have to do with the better antenna more than anything.

Range is a function of a number of factors though, so there will never be a static number you can quote for any radio. For example this radio has a removeable antenna. I can take off the 9" or antenna and attached a 25" or 48" antenna and get better range. Many people have a big antenna on their vehicle for this purpose and just carry the little 9" one portable. If you are concerned about range, a "hardcore" amateur may take a mid-sized antenna like 18-24" (they are a specific length for VHF or UHF, some compromise between both ideal lengths to make a dual band antenna).

I have heard that the wouxun outperforms many popular ham handhelds like icon/kenwood/yaesu in terms of audio quality and range, but then lacks in terms of technical features like number of channel memories, speed of scanning, screen size or number of characters on screen for channel names, etc... But I don't have any other radios to compare against as of now...

Amateur radio clubs throughout the country have set up linked repeaters, so that messages can be relayed automatically from one end of the province to another. There are also interprovincial links. Check out the Southern Alberta Repeater Association: http://www.saralink.ca to see the network of repeaters in Alberta.

In times of disaster, these links can be used for communication, however because of the amount of traffic over the frequency, the communication is run in the form of a “net”. The “net control” operator controls and directs who may speak to whom. It’s like the speaker in parliament - none of the mp’s address another directly, they all communicate through the speaker. There is no room in such a situation for you to call your buddy directly to see if he’s OK.

The repeaters at these sites are fairly complex.

A method of radio communication which has fallen into disuse with the expansion of the internet is “packet”. Text from a computer is fed through a modem to the radio, and translated back into text at the receiving end by another radio, also connected to a computer. A single radio can act as a repeater since the message is stored on the computer, and can be re-broadcast at a later time. While any radio tuned to the chosen frequency can receive the message, the duration of the message is quite brief, and the modem sound is unintelligible to anyone with only voice capability. This would allow at least a little privacy.

I have had my license for a number of years but have not been active for the last several. I am now getting back into radio - but I’m having trouble finding anyone interested in reviving an “old” system!

Nicely done, noob (me). This paragraph was supposed to have been the first one:

The range of any particular unit depends far more on antenna configuration and surrounding terrain more than anything else. I can hit repeaters 30 to 40 miles in some directions with a handheld and short antenna. With the same handheld and an antenna 20 feet in the air, I can hit repeaters nearly 100 miles away. This is all in the VHF amateur band 144-148 MHz. Repeater locations are chosen to maximize propagation - high ground, clear of obstacles like buildings or mountains.

Bump to keep alive.

I would still like to see a coast to coast ham network set up for preppers.
I have studied a bit, gut am a ways off from being able to challenge the exam.
Are there any hams here that could help figure this out?

I'm trying to get familiar with the various digital modes available. I have been playing with PSK31 on HF, which is like text messaging on the old "shortwave" frequencies. Messages are easily sent all over North America. The same type of system could ( I believe) be used for VHF, and accessible by handhelds over relatively shorter ranges. The equipment needed is a radio and a computer with a soundcard. The connection between the two can be a little tricky, but there are devices available for about $100 that will come configured for your radio.

I could see a network of local hubs which then forward messages to more remote hubs over HF. The overall setup would be similar to a Bulletin Board not unlike this forum. This was quite common in the 90's but the Internet, with its broader availability and higher speed made most hams lose interest. I'm still looking for someone local (Edmonton) to try such a setup with.