Moral Obligations To Non-Preppers What would you do?

What would I do? Make sure that my family is looked after then ensure I have done what I can for my friends. After that I would do what I can to help others. We are all in this together but charity begins at home.

When the lights go out, the survival game truly begins. You now have to play with the hand that you have dealt yourself. If you have lots of food, you might be able to barter for things you don't have. Those with firearms, may just try to take, from those who have what they want. If I chose to spend my money to stock up on food, meds, etc and my neighbor chose to spend their money on cigarettes and beer, I won't feel much sympathy for them when they are starving. I will barter, So choose your purchases wisely.

Preppersaurus

Howdy,

I think after SHTF alot of people will be shell shocked/emotional breakdowns while getting out of dodge and if I bump into friend or acquaintance and they still seem on even keel I would give them at least some food or a meal and some matches obviously keeping cautious about the person. A warm meal and kindness does do wonders for the soul.

This is a question that I have been putting to many people around where I live. For some reason I don't understand so many people believe that they may see the end of the world in their lifetime. But they are doing nothing to prepare aside from normal rural stuff, canning and the like. What is interesting is they see it as a very real question that they themselves may have to confront.

There was another thread a while ago about who would you let in after SHTF. In didn't write a response but I thought a lot about it. The answers I have are not yet completely developed. Here is what I have so far. I needed a framework to begin thinking about it so I asked myself what is the moral imperative? What are the set of principal's that would guide me? I discovered that they would all have to be a part of what actions I took or didn't take. So you have to prioritize which principal first. I choose, Justice. If I had the ability to feed 20 extra people, than those would be children. I choose justice because children had nothing to do with creating the state of the world. We did. We in particular the baby boomers have out of a complete focus on themselves depleted the world of it's ability to sustain itself and as a result deprived our children and grandchildren of maybe even having a life. So if I had to choose I would choose to give every child a chance to at least live for a while longer.

This approach turns out to have some very practical results in the right kind of community which I can write about some other time.

This is a question that I have been putting to many people around where I live. For some reason I don't understand so many people believe that they may see the end of the world in their lifetime. But they are doing nothing to prepare aside from normal rural stuff, canning and the like. What is interesting is they see it as a very real question that they themselves may have to confront.

There was another thread a while ago about who would you let in after SHTF. In didn't write a response but I thought a lot about it. The answers I have are not yet completely developed. Here is what I have so far. I needed a framework to begin thinking about it so I asked myself what is the moral imperative? What are the set of principal's that would guide me? I discovered that they would all have to be a part of what actions I took or didn't take. So you have to prioritize which principal first. I choose, Justice. If I had the ability to feed 20 extra people, than those would be children. I choose justice because children had nothing to do with creating the state of the world. We did. We in particular the baby boomers have out of a complete focus on themselves depleted the world of it's ability to sustain itself and as a result deprived our children and grandchildren of maybe even having a life. So if I had to choose I would choose to give every child a chance to at least live for a while longer.

This approach turns out to have some very practical results in the right kind of community which I can write about some other time.

I don't personally subscribe to the likelihood that the music will stop for all time and we will be forced into some kind of 19th century re-boot. It makes for good fiction but like vampires, and zombies, it just isn't likely. You may well find yourself feeding friends and neighbours during an extreme weather event because you are the only one with the foresight to have canned food, fuel, etc. I just don't see us all being our own personal protagonists in some post apocalyptic thriller. If someone knows something concrete which would lead one to believe otherwise, I'm all ears.

Antsy it is impossible to show the whole picture in this medium. We take a very small part and focus on some element for closer examination. Taken alone it does sound extreme. I don't believe the music will stop at all. I do believe it will get very low as the world goes through a terrible trouble time. I believe it will be a true coming of age for all of mankind. I am, unlike most people i talk to, an optimist . We do have a future and our children will be the ones who will make it whatever it will be. I would like to be able to play a role in helping make it a healthier time.

Antsy it is impossible to show the whole picture in this medium. We take a very small part and focus on some element for closer examination. Taken alone it does sound extreme. I don't believe the music will stop at all. I do believe it will get very low as the world goes through a terrible trouble time. I believe it will be a true coming of age for all of mankind. I am, unlike most people i talk to, an optimist . We do have a future and our children will be the ones who will make it whatever it will be. I would like to be able to play a role in helping make it a healthier time.

Ways', on what evidence do you believe that we will experience this, "terrible trouble time"? I'm just curious. That is not to say that I don't think that the world has been troubled in these last dozen decades, rather, you appear to imply something further or different than we have experienced thus far. Extraordinary claims indeed! I'm just looking for the extraordinary evidence which should support those claims. I understand that it may be difficult to explain your entire rational in a single post. Perhaps you could just give me the most compelling evidence that you are subscribing to so that I might too appreciate the urgency.

Antsy

I know this is an old threat, but I've been thinking about this, in terms of my sister. She came to live with me in August, til this coming April, to do her graduate degree at a local university. I gave her the rundown of where various tools & supplies are, and I think the thinks I have overly paranoid and will never need them. She has made fun of my prepping, in a light-hearted way, i.e "Is this for when the Zombie Apocalypse happens?" I charge her $100 rent and half of general household supplies like T.P. and garbage bags. She has zero interest in prepping and waits until we're out of something to mention it. I keep backups of everything but since she has made no move to reimburse me for something from my stores, I have started hiding my backups so she is forced to go & buy and I can maintain my preps. She is one of those people who dresses lightly with flimsy shoes cause we're in a car, with no thought to the fact you could get in an accident, get stuck, break down, etc. When we had a water main break for a weekend, I think she was relieved I had water stored. On one hand, she has very little income, lives for the moment and has always driven crap cars (she's carless now), but they money she does have is spent on travelling to exotic places. On the other hand, she has worked and volunteered in third world conditions in Honduras and India and I think, if push came to shove, she would have an adaptable mentality and a good sense of humour, if no tangible skills other than cooking (in a modern kitchen).

I think if there were an emergency to happen in the next 4 months (after which she's likely moving out), I would obviously help her, to the extent I could, in my household and share some of my food & water, but I wouldn't risk life & limb. She did sign as my reference on my PAL application too 🙂

I know this is an old threat, but I've been thinking about this, in terms of my sister. She came to live with me in August, til this coming April, to do her graduate degree at a local university. I gave her the rundown of where various tools & supplies are, and I think the thinks I have overly paranoid and will never need them. She has made fun of my prepping, in a light-hearted way, i.e "Is this for when the Zombie Apocalypse happens?" I charge her $100 rent and half of general household supplies like T.P. and garbage bags. She has zero interest in prepping and waits until we're out of something to mention it. I keep backups of everything but since she has made no move to reimburse me for something from my stores, I have started hiding my backups so she is forced to go & buy and I can maintain my preps. She is one of those people who dresses lightly with flimsy shoes cause we're in a car, with no thought to the fact you could get in an accident, get stuck, break down, etc. When we had a water main break for a weekend, I think she was relieved I had water stored. On one hand, she has very little income, lives for the moment and has always driven crap cars (she's carless now), but they money she does have is spent on travelling to exotic places. On the other hand, she has worked and volunteered in third world conditions in Honduras and India and I think, if push came to shove, she would have an adaptable mentality and a good sense of humour, if no tangible skills other than cooking (in a modern kitchen).

I think if there were an emergency to happen in the next 4 months (after which she's likely moving out), I would obviously help her, to the extent I could, in my household and share some of my food & water, but I wouldn't risk life & limb. She did sign as my reference on my PAL application too 🙂

From what I've just read, it looks like you are already stepping up to help your sister out. Since I subscribe to a much more moderate version of "personal calamity" vs. the Hollywood 5th Wave type, I'm open to helping out non-prepping folk as their need arises. To me, the SHTF is a personal war of attrition which often requires many helping hands to avoid. You are only charging your sister $100 per month plus expenses. I'm going to guess that she would have a hard time actualizing her goal of a Masters degree without your assistance. Good on you. Hopefully your sister will take what you are giving her to become a successful, contributing member of society and will have unwittingly picked up a few good habits from you. Ultimately, I hope she gets the chance to pay it forward as she becomes more established.

I know this is an old threat, but I've been thinking about this, in terms of my sister. She came to live with me in August, til this coming April, to do her graduate degree at a local university. I gave her the rundown of where various tools & supplies are, and I think the thinks I have overly paranoid and will never need them. She has made fun of my prepping, in a light-hearted way, i.e "Is this for when the Zombie Apocalypse happens?" I charge her $100 rent and half of general household supplies like T.P. and garbage bags. She has zero interest in prepping and waits until we're out of something to mention it. I keep backups of everything but since she has made no move to reimburse me for something from my stores, I have started hiding my backups so she is forced to go & buy and I can maintain my preps. She is one of those people who dresses lightly with flimsy shoes cause we're in a car, with no thought to the fact you could get in an accident, get stuck, break down, etc. When we had a water main break for a weekend, I think she was relieved I had water stored. On one hand, she has very little income, lives for the moment and has always driven crap cars (she's carless now), but they money she does have is spent on travelling to exotic places. On the other hand, she has worked and volunteered in third world conditions in Honduras and India and I think, if push came to shove, she would have an adaptable mentality and a good sense of humour, if no tangible skills other than cooking (in a modern kitchen).

I think if there were an emergency to happen in the next 4 months (after which she's likely moving out), I would obviously help her, to the extent I could, in my household and share some of my food & water, but I wouldn't risk life & limb. She did sign as my reference on my PAL application too 🙂

From what I've just read, it looks like you are already stepping up to help your sister out. Since I subscribe to a much more moderate version of "personal calamity" vs. the Hollywood 5th Wave type, I'm open to helping out non-prepping folk as their need arises. To me, the SHTF is a personal war of attrition which often requires many helping hands to avoid. You are only charging your sister $100 per month plus expenses. I'm going to guess that she would have a hard time actualizing her goal of a Masters degree without your assistance. Good on you. Hopefully your sister will take what you are giving her to become a successful, contributing member of society and will have unwittingly picked up a few good habits from you. Ultimately, I hope she gets the chance to pay it forward as she becomes more established.

Thanks for the positive spin to this one Antsy. Preppers do tend have an "I'm right, they're wrong" approach to problems it seems, I like your answer though. I think the masses are not generally inclined to prepping and new generations are further detached from subsistence or even hobby farming. But we should still be an example to those around us, even if we have to pick up the slack a bit at times.

Thanks for the positive spin to this one Antsy. Preppers to tend have an "I'm right, they're wrong" approach to problems it seems, I like your answer. I think the masses are not generally inclined to prepping and new generations are more and more detached from subsistence or even hobby farming. But we should still be an example to those around us, even if we have to pick up the slack a bit at times.

Aww shucks HC 😳
Thanks for the kind words and works. Happy New Year to you and yours.

Thanks for the kind words. I'd like to think some of my habits rub off on her...convinced her to try dehydrating, after she turned down the opportunity to learn to make soap, make fish jerky, and learning to use a ham radio. When something breaks of hers or she loses something, I *usually* have something in my tickle trunk to fix it.

I think there is a fine line - between being that resourceful person which people come to, and learn from - versus them thinking they don't need to learn or do, because you always will. I think my friends and neighbors are in the first group, probably due to their age, and my sister is currently mostly in the second, again due to her age and immaturity.

side note: reading this again I noticed all my typos in my earlier post 😳 ..I think I am getting over a near-miss with the flu

I think we also tend to be quite enthusiastic while others may look at us from a more agnostic point of view. (Which reminds me of a friend's bumper sticker which read: "the hardest thing about a zombie apocalypse would be to appear as though I'm not excited!")

Seems like you may be trying to show a tad too much to your sister which may be overwhelmingly underwhelming for her: ham radio, dehydrating, jerky making, soap making.... Maybe focus on one specific thing you may be more likely to have in common and Segway into another form of prepping from there?

I'm glad this thread has come up again.

After comments made to me , something like " we'll just come to your place if something happens " ,
it has made me even more guarded and secretive. They say stupid things such
as you only need a weeks worth of supplies, or 72 hours .
With that in mind, the non prepared people will really
think all of us have hoards of stuff and should share and that we are greedy .
When I hear them say they are coming to my house, I realize I must have let
too much information out, and better hush up , I reply with:
" no point coming here , I only have 72 hours worth of stuff for myself "

This is scary , because they have no concept of how fast supplies can run out, that it might have taken
years to put together and you have a plan . You work hard , you garden and dehydrate and can stuff.
You invest in water containers , tools , tarps , boots, etc etc, while they might travel and buy sports cars.
They have no idea that we plan on bartering , and replenishing and networking.
To them it is just use it up and somebody will provide more.

The idea that what we hoard , prep, garden, belongs to everyone you know, and divided out equally when
only you contribute will just not work . Your supplies will run out. I think the answer again is to continue to find like minded
people with a variety of skills, and tread lightly on letting non believers know what you are doing.

I would sooner help someone with nothing if they at least understand and believe in prepping, and want to prep,
but as yet has not started, than help someone who laughed at what I was doing and did not believe in prepping.

I have some very elderly neighbors I would be checking in on and helping .

I'm glad this thread has come up again.

After comments made to me , something like " we'll just come to your place if something happens " .

Goldie, my answer to this nonsense is..

'Remember those mice I have been havin' trouble with...?"

then wait for their nod/respond.

" well they got into all my food stuffs and I had to toss most of it out....the rest I may feed to the chickens. So what have you got you can help me out with when you come?? Cause I am about to give up on prepping."

Goldie, how much ya wanna bet they would soon lose any interest in your place/supplies.
Between the mice and you askin for THEIR help, should do it. 😉

And if that doesn't work... add in:
" you should see what they did to my extra bedding and such!"